[theme-reviewers] Tinymce button that only adds css codes.. still plugin territory?

[Ünsal Korkmaz]

Released 1.1.1 version:

http://themes.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/11449
Removed plugin territory features except tinymce button. I believe tinymce
button thats just adding span,div with classes can be theme territory.
Thanks everyone for your time

On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 4:45 PM, Chip Bennett <chip at chipbennett.net> wrote:

> If there is no semantic value, then why would the user want to wrap
> content in <span class="foo bar"></span>? There is obviously some *use* or
> *purpose* for the user explicitly wrapping content in a container with
> defined CSS selectors. The *nature* of that intended purpose helps to
> clarify whether it is Theme territory or Plugin territory.
>
> Sometimes questions don't have a single, black-and-white answer, but
> instead depend on context. (For example: post custom meta boxes are not
> inherently Theme or Plugin territory; that determination depends on the
> intended use of the defined custom post meta data handled by those meta
> boxes.) So, by asking, "what is the semantic meaning of the code added by
> the TinyMCE buttons?" I'm trying to drive to the intended purpose, to
> ensure that we're all discussing the question in the correct context.
>
> I mentioned shortcodes among a list of other things in the Theme that are
> Plugin territory. Yes, it is a separate issue from the question of TinyMCE
> buttons, but in your OP, you said, "there are no shortcodes, only added
> TinyMCE buttons". I was merely pointing out that "there are no shortcodes"
> is untrue, because the Theme does define shortcodes (along with many other
> things that are Plugin territory).
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 9:32 AM, Ünsal Korkmaz <unsalkorkmaz at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Let's back up a bit: why would <span class="foo bar"></span> be added to
>>> post content to begin with? What is the semantic meaning of such a
>>> container?
>>
>>
>> Seriously?
>>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Span_and_div
>> In HTML <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTML>, the *span* and *div*
>> elements <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTML_element> are used for
>> generic organizational or stylistic applications, typically when extant
>> meaningful elements have exhausted their purpose.
>> *span* and *div* is not semantic.. its for design. Colors, boxes, icons
>> are not semantic.. Those are design that shows content better.
>>
>> Are we talking about core-defined shortcodes or not? If they're defined
>>> in core, why do they need to be defined in the Theme?
>>
>>
>>  Original question:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>> My theme:
>>> http://themes.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/11437
>>> Theme is adding custom tinymce button that adds css code for design
>>> elements. There is no shortcode or something.. just css code.
>>> Its allowed in themes right?
>>
>>
>> There is a tinymce button added with theme. That button adds css code
>> when you click it. ITs not adding shortcode and esspecially i am saying its
>> not adding any shortcode. I NEVER said theme does not support any
>> shortcode. Theme is supporting 3 shortcode thats wordpress default
>> shortcodes: audio, video, gallery. Why did you link shortcodes file and
>> said "aha there is shortcode"? What is purpose here?
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 4:23 PM, Chip Bennett <chip at chipbennett.net>wrote:
>>
>>> Let's back up a bit: why would <span class="foo bar"></span> be added to
>>> post content to begin with? What is the semantic meaning of such a
>>> container?
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 9:16 AM, Daniel Tara <contact at onedesigns.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Speaking a bit more generally I believe there always be this conflict
>>>> between content generation and content presentation. Content generation is
>>>> plugin territory but if plugins also add their own styling what are the
>>>> chances that styling fits a random theme. I say not styled content is
>>>> better than ugly styled content. I think we should allow more middle ground
>>>> here.
>>>>
>>>> Daniel
>>>>
>>>> On Mar 3, 2013, at 4:10 PM, Ünsal Korkmaz wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for review but i mean tinymce does not adding shortcode, it
>>>> adds css code.
>>>> http://themes.svn.wordpress.org/firmasite/1.1.0/functions/shortcodes.php
>>>> Those shortcodes are wordpress's default shortcodes. audio, gallery,
>>>> video.
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 4:07 PM, Chip Bennett <chip at chipbennett.net>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hmm, actually, there *are* shortcodes:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://themes.svn.wordpress.org/firmasite/1.1.0/functions/shortcodes.php
>>>>>
>>>>> And this is definitely Plugin territory:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://themes.svn.wordpress.org/firmasite/1.1.0/functions/remove-comments-absolute.php
>>>>>
>>>>> And a good deal of this is Plugin territory:
>>>>> http://themes.svn.wordpress.org/firmasite/1.1.0/functions/fix.php
>>>>>
>>>>> And this is also probably Plugin territory (though a bit of a gray
>>>>> area):
>>>>>
>>>>> http://themes.svn.wordpress.org/firmasite/1.1.0/functions/custom-sharing-buttons.php
>>>>>
>>>>> http://themes.svn.wordpress.org/firmasite/1.1.0/functions/custom-facebook-comments.php
>>>>>
>>>>> But, for the TinyMCE buttons: my initial reaction would be to say that
>>>>> they also are probably Plugin territory. What do the buttons do? What do
>>>>> they add to the post content? Wrap selected content in <span class="foo
>>>>> bar"></span> tags? Sure, that degrades more gracefully than un-parsed
>>>>> shortcodes, but it would still result in a bunch of unused markup scattered
>>>>> throughout the user's posts after switching Themes. *Thus, I would
>>>>> say that the TinyMCE buttons are also Plugin territory*. I would
>>>>> recommend defining the *styles* for the CSS classes added via the TinyMCE
>>>>> buttons, but make the underlying TinyMCE button functionality itself a
>>>>> Plugin.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Chip
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 8:00 AM, Ünsal Korkmaz <unsalkorkmaz at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>> My theme:
>>>>>> http://themes.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/11437
>>>>>> Theme is adding custom tinymce button that adds css code for design
>>>>>> elements. There is no shortcode or something.. just css code.
>>>>>> Its allowed in themes right?
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
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