[wp-hackers] WordPress Maturity (was)Re: hate

[Marko Heijnen]

No clue what kind of issues you have with deployments and how WordPress need to solve them. Same counts for content staging. It isn't something WordPress need to care of. Also content staging is always a pain but not a common one when you have good rules.

Test coverage is growing and there isn't a real good coverage number for as I know. You need to run the unit tests in different ways to do so.

Code quality in plugins isn't something WordPress core can fix. Also when you think that is an issue then build it yourself. That is always what I do for large scale environments. It's almost stupid to use a plugin for something that does so much more then needed.

About capital_P_dangit() you are right and we do a lot of feature creeping right now as the Post format UI and to less focus on bug fixing.
This doesn't mean you can't create a ticket and looking at your tickets you don't do it wrong at all. 1 closed, 1 fixed with props and 2 open tickets where 1 is debatable for a fix.

Marko

Op 30 apr. 2013, om 17:33 heeft Harry Metcalfe <harry at dxw.com> het volgende geschreven:

>> Some of these are growing pains and to be expected, but in part these are
>> issues with a community that, while fundamentally impressive in what it has
>> accomplished, nonetheless seems to lack a certain maturity of software
>> experience. I have been shocked to be told right here, by leaders, that the
>> problem with updating a database when moving from development to a live URL
>> is not a problem with WordPress. Search and replace in a database is a
>> fundamentally unsafe operation, and to recommend third party tools for this
>> absolutely necessary function suggests a real lack of experience with real
>> world large-scale (i.e. corporate) sites.
>> 
>> As one final example of what I see as a "teenage growth period" rather than
>> "selling out", I fully expect to have a  couple of suspects here explain to
>> me in glorious detail why and how I'm wrong. At least, that's the response
>> I have gotten, not from lurkers or noobs, but from some of the luminaries
>> of WordPress when I have raised issues that affect many of my clients'
>> adoptions before. Rather than wanting to learn from the on the ground
>> cases, people who raise these issues are often told we're doing it wrong or
>> we should buck up and be a real programmer and write a script, or...
> 
> A lot of that resonates with me, too. Particularly about lack of experience in large scale environments. We build and host WordPress websites for the UK government and the following problems top my list:
> 
> * Ease of deployment and switching between environments
> * Content staging (other than post/page previews)
> * Poor test coverage
> * Dreadful code quality in plugins
> 
> Like Shasta, I'm confident that these are growth problems rather than "selling out" (I'm not even sure what the latter means, really...)
> 
> But I am also often pretty irritated by stuff posted here, and by infantile features like this one:
> 
> https://github.com/WordPress/WordPress/blob/master/wp-includes/formatting.php#L3301
> 
> After my experience trying to push back on that, and on a few other things, I think twice before raising tickets or submitting patches. For fear that they'll just be rejected out of hand. Or that, without hours of tedious discussion, nothing will happen.
> 
> In that example, Matt more or less decided that scratching his own itch was more important than the autonomy of WordPress' users, and then suggested we write a plugin.
> 
> Sigh.
> 
> Harry
> 
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