<html><head>
<meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head><body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">I think the problem for
some of us, and what was confusing me, was the assertion that the
removed code violated GPL rather than simply violating WPORG
requirements. If that were the case then simply porting to a plugin
would not be good enough, because it was still a GPL issue.<br>
<br>
But the actual case is that the code *only* violated WPORG, not GPL
requirements.<br>
<br>
I think, too, that sometimes I fail to recognize that WPORG requirements
go further than GPL requirements.<br>
<br>
<blockquote style="border: 0px none;"
cite="mid:CAEytdhdDPU3tjGyPzP2-63Uj+V+H2tui+Hyk+j7GM9TUKt=DQw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div style="margin:30px 25px 10px 25px;" class="__pbConvHr"><div
style="display:table;width:100%;border-top:1px solid
#EDEEF0;padding-top:5px"> <div
style="display:table-cell;vertical-align:middle;padding-right:6px;"><img
photoaddress="emil@uzelac.me" photoname="Emil Uzelac"
src="cid:part1.02050108.03060305@danemorganmedia.com"
name="postbox-contact.jpg" height="25px" width="25px"></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;width:100%">
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:emil@uzelac.me"
style="color:#737F92
!important;padding-right:6px;font-weight:bold;text-decoration:none
!important;">Emil Uzelac</a></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;">
<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">Friday, September
20, 2013 14:00</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div dir="ltr">The issue is no
longer an issue. It was taken care by PageLines.<div>Codes are removed
and I believe that we mentioned this few times</div><div>already.
Currently Theme in question does not have any GPL issues.</div>
</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><br></div>
<div>_______________________________________________<br>theme-reviewers
mailing list<br><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:theme-reviewers@lists.wordpress.org">theme-reviewers@lists.wordpress.org</a><br><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.wordpress.org/mailman/listinfo/theme-reviewers">http://lists.wordpress.org/mailman/listinfo/theme-reviewers</a><br></div></div>
<div style="margin:30px 25px 10px 25px;" class="__pbConvHr"><div
style="display:table;width:100%;border-top:1px solid
#EDEEF0;padding-top:5px"> <div
style="display:table-cell;vertical-align:middle;padding-right:6px;"><img
photoaddress="trent@cyberchimps.com" photoname="Trent Lapinski"
src="cid:part2.04030006.09090101@danemorganmedia.com"
name="postbox-contact.jpg" height="25px" width="25px"></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;width:100%">
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:trent@cyberchimps.com"
style="color:#737F92
!important;padding-right:6px;font-weight:bold;text-decoration:none
!important;">Trent Lapinski</a></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;">
<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">Friday, September
20, 2013 13:55</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><meta content="text/html;
charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="content-type"><div>I've just been
watching this so far, and I have to admit I'm getting confused as well.</div><div><br></div><div>Are
subscription based themes and plugins that limit usage if the user
stops paying allowed on .org?</div><div><br></div><div><div>If no, then
the theme shouldn't be allowed on .org until they change their pricing
model.</div><div><br></div><div>If yes, can someone please explain how
this is GPL compatible?</div></div><div><br></div><div>This answer will
have a drastic effect on all upsell themes and pricing models for theme
shops. We need a clear yes or no answer with a defined explanation. </div><div><br></div><div>This
isn't an us vs. them situation. This is simply a "is this allowed?" and
so far not a single admin or .org representative seems to have an
answer. </div><div><br></div><div>Can we please get a clarification so
we can put this issue to rest once and for all?</div><div><br><div>--Trent
Lapinski</div><div>CEO of CyberChimps</div>Sent from my iPad</div><div><br>On
Sep 20, 2013, at 11:08 AM, Bryan Hadaway <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:bhadaway@gmail.com">bhadaway@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote
type="cite"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><b>@Otto</b><br></div><div><br>Just
because you disagree with me does not make the issues I'm raising a
rant and it's not fair for you to be dismissive in that manner. Also,
I'm not concerned that this discussion is being ignored. I wasn't even
the one who started this discussion so clearly others have the same
concerns. Furthermore, are you even reading my responses? They're very
concise and backed up with facts, links, quotes etc.<br>
<br></div>The GPL is not just about code and never has been, that's only
part of it. I think it more importantly has to do with usage rights and
specifically to the point, our roles of protecting the users of this
community, hence additional WP policies and guidelines.<br>
<br></div>No, I haven't reviewed the new ticket theme code nor will I
nor should I, as I don't need to, that's completely irrelevant. The only
proof needed is right here:<br><br><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.pagelines.com/pricing/">http://www.pagelines.com/pricing/</a><br>
<br></div>You already made your point that "Well, marketing language is
one thing and the fine print is another..." (paraphrasing of course) and
I already agreed that is a good point generally, but doesn't apply here
as the theme developer has already clarified that it's not a support
limit, but a usage one.<br>
<br></div>I couldn't be more calm, clear and concise in my
communications. Nothing I've said has been frantic or hyperbole in the
least.<br><br></div>You say that I need to be more clear and backup what
I'm saying, well if you disagree with me, I invite you to do the same.
If you disagree with me, here's what you're saying:<br>
<br></div><b>1. Under the GPL, we're allowed to sell themes, but
restrict how many websites our customers are allowed to use those themes
on.</b><br><br></div><b>2. Under WP policy, if we submit plugins or
themes, we're not required to keep all our WordPress works GPL
compatible.</b><br>
<br></div>Is that what you're saying? And if not, I'm completely failing
to understand what you mean. Instead of just disagreeing with me, do
you have a rebuttal?<br></div>
</div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>theme-reviewers
mailing list</span><br><span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:theme-reviewers@lists.wordpress.org">theme-reviewers@lists.wordpress.org</a></span><br><span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.wordpress.org/mailman/listinfo/theme-reviewers">http://lists.wordpress.org/mailman/listinfo/theme-reviewers</a></span><br></div></blockquote><pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
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</pre></div>
<div style="margin:30px 25px 10px 25px;" class="__pbConvHr"><div
style="display:table;width:100%;border-top:1px solid
#EDEEF0;padding-top:5px"> <div
style="display:table-cell;vertical-align:middle;padding-right:6px;"><img
photoaddress="bhadaway@gmail.com" photoname="Bryan Hadaway"
src="cid:part3.02060009.07030201@danemorganmedia.com"
name="postbox-contact.jpg" height="25px" width="25px"></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;width:100%">
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:bhadaway@gmail.com"
style="color:#737F92
!important;padding-right:6px;font-weight:bold;text-decoration:none
!important;">Bryan Hadaway</a></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;">
<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">Friday, September
20, 2013 13:08</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><b>@Otto</b><br></div><div><br>Just
because you disagree with me does not make the issues I'm raising a
rant and it's not fair for you to be dismissive in that manner. Also,
I'm not concerned that this discussion is being ignored. I wasn't even
the one who started this discussion so clearly others have the same
concerns. Furthermore, are you even reading my responses? They're very
concise and backed up with facts, links, quotes etc.<br>
<br></div>The GPL is not just about code and never has been, that's only
part of it. I think it more importantly has to do with usage rights and
specifically to the point, our roles of protecting the users of this
community, hence additional WP policies and guidelines.<br>
<br></div>No, I haven't reviewed the new ticket theme code nor will I
nor should I, as I don't need to, that's completely irrelevant. The only
proof needed is right here:<br><br><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.pagelines.com/pricing/">http://www.pagelines.com/pricing/</a><br>
<br></div>You already made your point that "Well, marketing language is
one thing and the fine print is another..." (paraphrasing of course) and
I already agreed that is a good point generally, but doesn't apply here
as the theme developer has already clarified that it's not a support
limit, but a usage one.<br>
<br></div>I couldn't be more calm, clear and concise in my
communications. Nothing I've said has been frantic or hyperbole in the
least.<br><br></div>You say that I need to be more clear and backup what
I'm saying, well if you disagree with me, I invite you to do the same.
If you disagree with me, here's what you're saying:<br>
<br></div><b>1. Under the GPL, we're allowed to sell themes, but
restrict how many websites our customers are allowed to use those themes
on.</b><br><br></div><b>2. Under WP policy, if we submit plugins or
themes, we're not required to keep all our WordPress works GPL
compatible.</b><br>
<br></div>Is that what you're saying? And if not, I'm completely failing
to understand what you mean. Instead of just disagreeing with me, do
you have a rebuttal?<br></div>
<div>_______________________________________________<br>theme-reviewers
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<div style="margin:30px 25px 10px 25px;" class="__pbConvHr"><div
style="display:table;width:100%;border-top:1px solid
#EDEEF0;padding-top:5px"> <div
style="display:table-cell;vertical-align:middle;padding-right:6px;"><img
photoaddress="otto@ottodestruct.com" photoname="Otto"
src="cid:part4.02000100.03040105@danemorganmedia.com"
name="postbox-contact.jpg" height="25px" width="25px"></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;width:100%">
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:otto@ottodestruct.com"
style="color:#737F92
!important;padding-right:6px;font-weight:bold;text-decoration:none
!important;">Otto</a></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;">
<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">Friday, September
20, 2013 12:07</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div><!----><br>BTW, what you
are referring to here (the "pro" code) was in the<br>first version they
submitted. Are you saying that this same code<br>exists in the second
version, the one you actually wrote about in<br>ticket?<br><br>Because
if so, fine. But I was under the impression that they had<br>already
addressed that and moved the "pro" code into a separate plugin<br>which
they are selling separately. If true, this means two things:<br>a) They
fixed the problem well before your decision to criticize them<br>for it,
and<br>b) You never even looked at the new version of the theme before<br>posting
in the ticket about it.<br><br>Please correct me if I'm incorrect. What
exactly about the theme<br>currently is in violation of the rules?
Facts, not rhetoric.<br><br>-Otto<br>_______________________________________________<br>theme-reviewers
mailing list<br><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:theme-reviewers@lists.wordpress.org">theme-reviewers@lists.wordpress.org</a><br><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.wordpress.org/mailman/listinfo/theme-reviewers">http://lists.wordpress.org/mailman/listinfo/theme-reviewers</a><br></div></div>
<div style="margin:30px 25px 10px 25px;" class="__pbConvHr"><div
style="display:table;width:100%;border-top:1px solid
#EDEEF0;padding-top:5px"> <div
style="display:table-cell;vertical-align:middle;padding-right:6px;"><img
photoaddress="bhadaway@gmail.com" photoname="Bryan Hadaway"
src="cid:part3.02060009.07030201@danemorganmedia.com"
name="postbox-contact.jpg" height="25px" width="25px"></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;width:100%">
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:bhadaway@gmail.com"
style="color:#737F92
!important;padding-right:6px;font-weight:bold;text-decoration:none
!important;">Bryan Hadaway</a></div> <div
style="display:table-cell;white-space:nowrap;vertical-align:middle;">
<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">Friday, September
20, 2013 08:55</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div><b>@Emil</b>
- So, you tell us we cannot discuss here in-list and should post
in-ticket:<br><br>"This discussion is inappropriate for this list. As
noted few times here if you have any questions please add them to the
ticket directly, not here."<br>
<br></div>So, we do that and then you tell us it's inappropriate to do
that? Then you create unnecessary rhetoric about this being simply an
issue of CyberChimps Vs PageLines. And because of this, you're just
going to ignore all legitimate issues raised by "competitors". Any of us
at all that develop themes, which is most of us, are technically
competitors.<br>
<br></div>And besides all that, you're the one who alerted me to the
original DMS ticket in the first place!<br><br></div><b>@Admins</b> - I
have never in my life wished so much that I didn't work for CyberChimps
(because I love working there), just because this is going to be used to
discredit anything that's said. This ticket (<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://themes.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/14369">https://themes.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/14369</a>)
is spiraling out of control fast because of unnecessary rhetoric
created on all sides. Can we please get you to step in and forget who
said what and simply look at all the facts?<br>
<br></div><b>@Community/Theme Developers</b> - You guys are the ones
that raised this discussion in the first place, don't let this be
cheapened into some sort of unfounded petty attack by CyberChimps and
let that be used as some sort of catalyst for special treatment or
exceptions to allow a theme that none of us could get approved,
approved. You guys can see all the issues here just fine without my
help.<br>
<br></div>This is not and never will be just some personal issue, this
effects us all. If we allow a free theme to be accepted who's pro theme
abuses and takes advantage of users in the form of restricting usage
based on how much they pay and also forces them to continue paying
indefinitely or their theme will be handicapped creates a precedent that
we're all allowed to do that.<br>
<br></div><div>Even if some loophole in the GPL has been found, while I
don't think so because this so obviously and blatantly goes against
everything the GPL stands for, this is still wrong!<br></div><div><br></div>It's
so incredibly absurd that I have to try so hard to do the right thing
when that's the entire point of this review process, to protect users
from these kinds of things.<br>
</div>
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</blockquote>
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